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Tech Stories Archives - November 2007
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2.
Aussie finds world's smallest starfish
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,22685948-421,00.html
This story, for us here, should be known as "Size DOESN'T matter". they are still starfish. My fave quote about the less than 5mm evil:
"Dr O'Hara said they had also determined that, like other starfish, the paddle-spined seastar reproduces by splitting itself in two.
"It uses its little sucker feet to pull itself apart into two pieces" [By: timelady / 2007-11-01]
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PASTINA!!! - ShujinTribble
So this bloke spends all his time _seeking_ out starfish? needs a clue by four ! -macbeth
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3.
Windows activation BS
I had a minor problem machine in to troubleshoot yesterday. We unplugged a no longer used 10gb HDD and swapped a stick of RAM to give the poor thing 512. Upon booting it tells me that Windows needs activation. The disconnected drive was not previously the primary drive, it was booting from the original primary. So does changing a stick of RAM now qualify for a re-activation? After a bit of buggerising around we had Windows re-activated but after a restart/Windows update it's been WGA'ed, all on a proprietry machine with a clean history. Please explain Bill.[By: Bloke / 2007-11-01]
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A mythical axe has been in someone's family for twenty generations. Except of course the handle has been replace a dozen times and the head was replaced twice too. -TieDyedDinosaur
It's those damn software pirates. If they hadn't been stealing my software since the mid-80's, I'd be a trillionaire now instead of just a billionaire. Bastards. Love, Bill. -RiffRaff
Dear Bill, if the pirates hadn't been stealing your software since the 80s, it wouldn't have the market share it has (and how I wish it didn't!). No love, -TheDeathOfRats
I've upgraded RAM and added hard drives without getting an activation prompt, but I suspect that removing the drive triggered the activation thingy in Windows since the amount of available disk space has changed. -cecil36
Changing the RAM outside of certain ranges will be a strike of the three that require activation. Changing a drive will be one of the three strikes. Something else has changed in the last 180 days (IIRC on the window) that added a strike, making three strikes. Of course, if you added the RAM and the BIOS decided to reenumerate ... -ralphp1024
Oh, HI! I upgraded your RAM -ShujinTribble
I r wee-ga kat...I r in ur systemz, deactivating ur windoze. -EtherRabbit
The third was probably a recent patch that changed some firmware identifiers (At least thats how I read the story) No actual change to hardware, the perfect M$ Gotcha, and is it me or the people on the phone when you call with the jillion digit number getting even more clueless? -jerrybear
corporate edition ftw -Gecko
I had to call MS support to get XP activated again after moving a USB card from one PCI slot to another. -AmazingKreskin
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4.
Wish Me Luck! NT OT
I start a new job today. I interviewed yesterday and they want me to start today. Bench/Field Tech, permanent job (No more contracts!) good pay with benefits...
The only downside is I have to wear a tie![By: VWFtech / 2007-11-01]
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Congratulations! Now imagine that the tie is really just a fancy shirt protector and in no time it will be second nature. -TieDyedDinosaur
One word...Tie clip. Okay, it's 2 words, but trust me you'll need it. And Gratz! -BarmanVarn
Ties, a clothing accessory that allows you to store soup for later use, and can choke you at the same time, often deemed a necessary evil... -garwain
There are apparently still places where one can buy a tie, pocket-protector, and eyeglasses tape as a set.... -Grue
congratz. if you have to wear a tie, may i suggest something from the Dilbert collection? -EtherRabbit
Congratz! Best of luck :) -elcapitane
Congrats and lotsa luck! -Seamyst
What was it that Roland said in The Dark Tower... something about walking around with a noose around the neck? Yeah, something like that. :-) <Hex? Return Me! ...to the LART shelter!> -ZorglubZ
Suit - Ugly and uncomfortable business attire. Usually accompanied with a tie, a device designed to restrict the flow of blood to the brain. (This explains the behavior of suit wearers.) </Scott Adams> -VoiceOfSanity
New idea for techs in this position- a combined tie and "pocket protector", to carry pen, pencil, mini-screwdriver, etc. Too late to get into production for this holiday season, but next year? -Voz
Or, you can wear THIS tie.... http://www.thinkgeek.com/apparel/hats-ties/57ff/ -kman52000
Great to hear that VWFTech! I hope its everything they told you it was (and not a creeping responsibility special). OBligatory tie joke: Why do managers wear ties? Keeps the foreskin from riding up. -Darkridr
The question is, do you have restrictions on the ties you CAN wear? Otherwise, go with stuff like: http://tinyurl.com/2rh26j or http://tinyurl.com/2rq639 or http://tinyurl.com/2umxf4 -exzyle2k
exzyle2k - pretty sure the first one is a no, but the other 2 might work... First day was the typical fill out paperwork and hang out and do nothing type of day.. Real stuff starts tomorrow.. -VWFtech
If you have to wear a tie, check the small print - I'll bet it doesn't say precisely WHERE you wear it. Use it as a belt. :-) -Gromit
From having had to wear a tie for many years: some advice. It's not the tie that cuts off the circulation to the head, it's the shirt. Make sure that the shirt collar is two-fingers loose when the top button is buttoned, then snug the tie to the shirt. Most people buying shirts don't realize how critical neck size is... -chazz
What Chazz said. Keep the collar of the shirt comfortable, just snug the tie up neatly, and all is cool, (at least until you have to flip the tie up over your shoulder to keep it from dropping into your work while you're working up cloe on a computer- that's annoying!) Enough of this, though... I'm channeling "Dress for Success" here- yeesh! -Voz
You could always wear your tie in U.S. Navy style and tuck it into your shirt about half way down (to avoid the wholel'dipping into my work' problem.) -LoTech
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5.
Dead battery replacement
Called up tech support to replace a dead battery on an X60. First I was refused support because I didn't have the serial number. Understandable (if annoying). Called back with the serial number and was refused service because I could not provide a "keyword." The problem is that the laptop was ordered using a credit card listed owned by "my workplace" and there was no keyword provided during the ordering process. I asked for the manager and he tells me that he cannot override the system (WTF are managers for then?). I was given two phone numbers to call (turned out to be Barnes and Noble) to resolve the issue with the keyword. Fortunately when my boss got on the phone with the manager (he had to call them back and they tried to hang up on him), the manager was somehow magically able to override the system. My only question is "WTF?" Can anyone explain how this type of tech support works? [By: slavik / 2007-11-01]
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It's simple, in order to reduce the amount of parts replaced you only replace them for "squeeky wheels." By not replacing parts for everyone that is covered under their warranty you can significantly reduce the costs of fixing the crap your company produces. This money can then be better spent increasing upper manglement's bonus's. -Olorin
Sounds like a relative the "purchasing a pack of gum" conundrum. -vacuumtubes
<da> The second time you were talking to Accenture or other comparable third party support group and they don't have access to overrides. The third time you actually reached the real companies support monkeys and they did have access. </da> Why am I making excuses for a bad company? -adarklite
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6.
And a reputation is born.
A co-worker was late to a meeting and another co-worker suggested he was 'brewing some de-caff'. Somehow it got heard as 'breaking some knee-caps'. It is now proper to ask if he is late who's knee-caps are getting it.[By: TieDyedDinosaur / 2007-11-01]
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Ah, so, he's in "the family business". -Stryker One
My spoose says "Yes, proper". Mind you, she is part Irish, so I assume this is cultural. -Mysty
My bad, I misquoted. It was 'Out BRUISING kneecaps.' Damn, too much sugar again. Happens every Halloween. -TieDyedDinosaur
Bruised kneecaps take on a whole different meaning... (paging Burkiss!) -VFox
"I gets my scrilla from bustin' caps." -AmazingKreskin
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8.
"An Internet Site"
The text of a ticket I had to deal with today:
"Customer went on an internet site, and now gets pornographic popups and computer is running slower than usual. Please upgrade RAM."
I'm sorry, but WTF? And I wonder what kind of "internet site" he was visiting? [By: katinahat / 2007-11-01]
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Yes, more RAM. The porn popups are slowing it down. User wants the popups to load faster. So more RAM. <looks for lart shelter, but can't see past the popups> -Ramblin
The kind of "Internet Site" where the starfish is afraid to say the name out loud where his mother or wife can hear... -cyberblade3001
Ticket Resolution: 'Removed computer, replaced with male ovine as per request. No questions asked.' -Belunar
WHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTT???? There are no Pop Ups on YouPorn.com?.... < tippy toes to LART Shelter > -kennz
kat, i feel for you, today has not been kind....i hope you have a better one tomorrow :) -EtherRabbit
"Here you go..." <sends 1 million rams to the customer...> -Dr Jerkyl
I'll RAM whatever porn popups... *LART shelter don't fail me now!* -unrenowned
"Customer poured fuel on engine. Now flames shoot out of engine compartment. Please install CD Player." -maciarc
Ticket Resolution: Installed Battering Ram Security Device for protection of computer against *fish. -PCChaos
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10.
nt/ot Cyber Jihad
In the slightly amusing category: http://debka.org/headline.php?hid=4723
Methinks its time to come up with a site featuring Ahemienjihad and Osam love pr0n and see how long it takes them to discover it let alone take it down.[By: adarklite / 2007-11-01]
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"What next."
-Warrick
It will probably be hacked by the goat, sheep and camel rights society! -TieDyedDinosaur
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11.
nt/ot-A Moment of Silence
As some of you might know Paul Tibbets the pilot of the Enola Gay and the man to drop the bomb on Hiroshima just died at the age of 92. While probably not the most pc thing to do I would like to congratulate him for a job well done. Because of you Mr. Tibbets I live in a world that is free from the tyranny of Hitler and a militaristic Japan.
The sad thing is that he requested that no funeral be held and that he be buried without a headstone so that there would be no protest. This I think points toward the sad affairs of what is going on in America. Let dead soldiers and their families have the peace they deserve. [By: adarklite / 2007-11-01]
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(*Bowed head*) I think he showed his honour for his country with that request; Don't haggle over me. I'm not that important. -ShujinTribble
In context, he did the right thing. If the Allies invaded the Japanese Home Islands, could you imagine the casualties? Think of Iwo Jima and Okinowa X 1 million, as the civilian populations were conditioned to fight to the last any way possible. The codenames for the invasion were Operation Olympic and Operation Coronet. Look them up on Wikipedia. Tibbets flew the mission he was assigned and shortened the war by months and millions of lives. -Wraith556
Just a heads up: Operations Olympic and Coronet are now both covered under Operation Downfall. -LinuXtreme
Historical note: said act did not prevent "the tyranny of Hitler." The Third Reich fell before either Little Man or Fat Boy did. -Captain Trips
The Politically Correct crowd carp on about the suffering of the Japanese in the bombing. What about the Chinese civilians in Nanking, and others who were subjected to poison gas and biological warfare from Unit 731? The PC crowd are very quiet about those atrocities. -Wraith556
I have to agree. The family deserves a funeral with headstone and appropriate marker. He just did a job which was less popular to anyone else. While I agree the suffering caused was not pleasnt or fair, at the same time it has to be looked at the following: "He, was given a mission that he carried out. In war, it's a lot harder to say know then you might think"
-Warrick
CT, Paul Tibbets was a bomber pilot in the Europe Theatre of Operations as well. He was one of the few to fight both the Germans and the Japanese. -adarklite
Although I disagree about the political reasons for the drop, I agree that this man should have a descent funeral with headstone and all the rest. He was just the messenger, and the ones to be blamed were those that decide these things behind the security of the desk in their offices. -Dr Jerkyl
The political side of this SHOULD be ignored - he was an extremely brave man to fly the mission (as were his crew) as no-one knew precisely what was going to happen, and one hell of a pilot - he had to handle that B29 like a fighter to get clear of the blastwave. -Gromit
Mr Tibbets has requested no marker, as he feels he had enough attention in life. He requested to be cremated and his ashes spread over the north Atlantic Ocean, as he said that flights over the north Atlantic were some of the most peaceful of his life. Here's to a man who did what needed to be done. -SalParadise
All of the veterans who served during the Second World War deserve respect and dignity. God knows the whiny pieces of shit that constitute the bulk of today's average Americana wouldn't have the balls to do what they did, and probably don't deserve the life they have due to the sacrifices made by true men (and women) 60 years ago. Rest in peace, Colonel. -RiffRaff
I don't think any of the people on that mission actually knew what was going to happen. I beleive that one of the crew members said "my G*d what have we done?" after the bomb droped. Can not conferm at this time -compbrat
I concur, Riff & Comp. He and his crew had no prior knowledge of what they were about to do, and the whiney PC crowd of today has no concept of what it took to end that tragic war. -MacDaddy
Amen adarklite. Amen. The Atom Bomb saved both America and Japan. The Japanese were preparing to fight for every square inch of soil, or kill themselves on losing. Also, if we had held out until the Russians got involved---anybody ever hear of the Russo-Japanese War? It would be like....well, letting France dictate surrender terms to Germany after World War I. We all saw how *that* turned out. As for our soldiers? We are still issuing Purple Hearts that were ordered and minted for "Downfall"--the invasion of Japan. -56Kdaytrader
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12.
Freaking Apple Tech Support Lusers
Got a customer's laptop back from Apple that had the hard drive click of death. They replaced the HD, took out the 3rd party memory (datamem.com) and claimed the 3rd party memory was causing problems. I put the datamem.com stick back in, the notebook fired up just fine and I gave it back to the customer after reinstalling applications. Two hours later, another professor who had talked to Apple about large black circles appearing on her display had gotten her notebook back from Apple. They had replaced the display, removed the 2 1GB memory modules from datamem and said they the memory modules were causing problems and would void her warranty. She called me because it wouldn't boot. She had talked to Apple "tech support" for an hour and they wanted her to send it back. She sensed bullshit and called me. Ah yes, the post is giving the sound indicating there is NO FUCKING MEMORY INSTALLED. Because Apple had removed it!!! The assholes removed her memory, and the idiot tech support folks weren't alert enough about that and wanted her to send it back to them. To eventually tell her "You don't have any memory modules installed" if she did so. Fuck Nuggets. I reinstalled the 3rd party memory and the notebook booted up just fine. What the hell kind of people is Apple hiring for tech support anyway? In both cases they had send the 3rd party memory back in ESD bags along with the notebooks. What the hell are those folks smoking? I want some of that.[By: crazymactech / 2007-11-01]
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They're not hiring. They are using acolytes from "The Cult of Steve Jobs". -Wraith556
They want to sell the hideously overpriced Apple memory instead... -smellystudent
as smelly said. all computer companies will claim that the warinty is void if they find somthing in the computer that was not in there. HP will do the same, and as far as i know they do not send back what you installed. -compbrat
I was able to buy the exact same memory that Apple uses from NewEgg at half the price that Apple sells it for... No griping about 3rd party RAM that way. -Griffin2020
That's why when you upgrade the memory in a mac you always save the ram it came with. When you send it in for service, take out the 3rd party stuff and put in the original ram, then they can't blame the 3rd party ram. -lasciate
I gotta admit, Apples' TS needs some improving. It took me 3 transfers to get to a tech who at least TRIED to give an answer. The rest just wanted to transfer me before they heard the issue. -MacDaddy
i pull out any devices that did not ship with the unit when it goes in. No risk of it going missing, getting damaged, etc. -TekkieNerd
Sounds like they have a contract with ClientLogic. -AmazingKreskin
When shopping for third-party RAM, one often gets what one pays for. Apple customers far too often go for price over quality when selecting RAM, having often blown their wad buying the computer. For every decent NewEgg DIMM, the techs are often removing ten made by Joe's Bait Shack and RAM-o-Rama. Furthermore, Apple takes a good-sized hit for repeat repairs, and would be damned if they are going to send the thing back in without the customer having at least tried it without the extra RAM. -56Kdaytrader
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14.
Plug it in, plug it in!
So I get this call 5 minutes before we are scheduled to close at 1 AM, and this is after only falling asleep at 9 AM the night before. Anyway, gotta make a manual connector after removing the router. Easy, right? She unplugs the router from the PC and then can't find the same farkin' port to plug it back in. So, in the next 20 minutes, she somehow manages to unplug her monitor, her keyboard, and probably her mouse (I'm not sure). Can she figure out how to plug the round peg back into the round hole? Of course not, she's not technical. Fark.[By: Jonos / 2007-11-01]
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And she has a tampon behind her ear and can't find her pencil! -TieDyedDinosaur
My technical expertise allows me to jachammer my round peg into any size/shape hole... *Awww crap! I'm channeling Burrkiss again..* -unrenowned
Username: bloodymary -vacuumtubes
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15.
The noisy hard drive
Yesterday I received a call from one of the users here. She says that her HD made a clicking noise and then she got a black screen saying Disk 1 failed. Fearing the worst I have her reboot. Gets a BIOS screen and the drive is not detected. I dispatch a hardware tech to replace her PC and try to recover the data. When I arrive today there's an update that the drive is totally dead and the data cannot be recovered. I inform the user, and ask if there is any critical data that needs to be recovered. She says no and is a bit dismayed that her favorites and some templates that she uses are gone. Then out comes this gem: It's been making some clicking noises for a while but I figured that shutting down the PC each night would make it stop. WTF was she thinking? The drive goes from silent to making noise and she doesn't call the helpdesk? She calls for every other little thing but not this... [By: Starfury / 2007-11-02]
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Don't you see? She solved the problem every night by turning the PC off. PC off == silent hard drive == problem solved. Well...only in her little world anyhow... -Cyan
I imagine that her car mechanic has some similar horror stories about her. -BarmanVarn
Agreed, BarmanVarn. My daughter's car engine was making a clattering sound & she fixed it...by turning up the stereo. -Tekkie
Starfury, I've got folks just like that here at my worksite. They have a problem, they simply turn off the system thinking it'll go away. Or worse, they'll see a message saying that Drive 0 is out of specs during boot (Dull Computers) but keep on going, figuring that it's still working, right? *sigh* At least they don't neep about losing data, that's what the mandated backup program is meant for... -VoiceOfSanity
Remember, always attempt a restart. If one doesn't fix it, restart again and again til it stop. -LazyLemming
I think your sig line says it all - you REALLY "Can't fix stupid" -lineswine
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16.
And People in Hell want Icewater
Today I was trading stories with one of our PFYs about our days on the helldesk and this one came to mind. A customer called in pissed off about the lack of service. This was the summer of 2004, and the Tampa area was being crisscrossed by hurricanes all summer. I told this guy it was going to be a 3 day wait for us to get a tech out. Given the circumstances I figured this was fairly reasonable. He demanded that I send him a tech out there that night or he was going to cancel his service. This was at 9:30PM, mind you, and all the techs were wrapping up at 8, so there was no way this was going to happen. again he told me to get him a tech out immediately or he was going to cancel his service. A little clickety clickety on my part and I told him I had a work order pulled up and just needed to verify whether he wanted this immediately or to wait a few weeks. "Are you DEAF?! I want it NOW!" So I said, "Fine. I'll go ahead and run the cancellation now. I just figured I'd give you the option of a few weeks to tell friends you were changing services and get your email in order." "WHATWHATWHAT?! You're cancelling my service?" I told him that he gave two options, and as I could not fulfill his first I would do my utmost to fulfill the second. Stellar customer service and all. Of course he starts working at 14.4 backpedals per second (starfish brain won't go much faster) and tells me three days will be just fine, and he went on his merry way. The boss had been listening in to the whole thing and asked me what the hell that was all about. I told him that it was like the guy showed up at a gunfight with a three-shooter and all the chambers were empty. I just didn't have the heart to go for the kill, so I kneecapped him. And people wonder how I got promoted.[By: Colonel32 / 2007-11-02]
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I suppose he didn't cancel for a long time... Nice LARTing! -Dr Jerkyl
The word for that maneuver is....elegant. -vacuumtubes
"Its like bringing a dead cat to a dogfight. You is going to get a lot of attention, aint none of it good." -TieDyedDinosaur
Nice. Very nice. -Grembo
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17.
Friday - what more can i say
Got up this morning soon as I got o my car *RING RING* driving ignore it, 30 secs later RING RING, every 30 fucking seconds of my 2 minute 30 drive to work. So before I returned the call I checked the usual culprits for probslems, yep ASP.net had failed, took down IIS restarted
RING RING
ME:R3tude morning
SF:WHY HAVENT YOU RETURNED MY CALL
ME:Because after having my phone ringing non stop since leaving the house I was checking the problems before hand so I can tell you whats going on.
SF:WHY DIDNT YOU BLOODY ANSWER THEN
ME:I WAS FUCKING DRIVING
SF:BOLLOX
ME:Oh yeah no of course yeah I walk to work with fucking rocket boots my car just follows.
SF:Well the intranet page is down people are pulling their hair out can't get to web apps
ME:Oh so typing an address in the address bar is beyond you all, ok fuck sake
SF:We'll you could tell people you are fucking fixing it
ME:I wasnt fixing it I was looking to see the problem so I could return your call.Goodbye.
E-mail: From R3tude
Dear all
As the Intranet page is down being the key to the entire internet and is causing the resultant apocalypse. May I please point you to the magical thing called the "Address Bar" here you can type the address manually and as if by magic it works just the same as the links on the intranet page.
4 phone calls so far and all with similar levels of abuse, I've fucking had enough.[By: r3tude / 2007-11-02]
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I can't fix your problem if I am talking to you on the phone. But if you would rather I talk to you then lets get to it. How's your Mum? What did you have for breakfast? Whats that? You'd rather I actually fix the problem? They why are you making me stay on the phone and talk to you? <click> -Madrigorne
All future inquiries may be directed to
you-all-can-go@fuckyourselves.com. -vacuumtubes
"WHY WASN'T I NOTIFIED??!?!??!???!??!" Did you read the email?- "WHAT EMAIL?!?!?!?!?!?" - The one we sent out about 15 minutes ago. - "I delete all mail from IT SO WHY WASN'T I NOTIFIED?!?!?!?!??!" -- Sorry for the caps but that is a pet peeve of mine. -Olorin
That's why during an emergency, I close the blinds, lock the door, and disconnect the phone (in whatever order seems more important at the time) Remove the distractions, then the work can get done, and only 2 people have the key to my server room... myself and the boss, and he's afraid to step foot in there since he accidently rebooted the phone system during the buisiest work hours. -garwain
It all started when we decided it was too tough for a computer user to use a command line, and they started selling this operating system with these "windows". -Voz
*sighs* Man it sounds like the people you have to work for are idiots, weapons grade idiots.
-Warrick
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18.
Your Tech Giggle of the Day
I hold the support cell phone. My ringtone is Green Day's Basket Case and for those of you not familiar here's the first verse:
Do you have the time
To listen to me whine
About nothing and everything
All at once
I am one of those
Melodramatic fools
Neurotic to the bone
No doubt about it
[By: Leah2112 / 2007-11-02]
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Perfect choice! -Seamyst
I set mine to the Imperial March -unrenowned
Mine is the theme from Halo. Granted this makes me want a case of sticky grenades. -virusjtg
Mine's ST TNG red alert. -ThinTheHerd
For a while I had Yakety-Sax from Benny Hill as my supervisors ringtone. -MarloVino
Mine is very esoteric--varies between the 1968 CBS Radio News stinger and the late 1960's Mutual Radio News stinger. Everyone within earshot perk up when it rings... :-) -vacuumtubes
Mine is the original communicator whistle from ST TOS. Unless it's Magenta calling me, and she gets "Priority One message from Starfleet coming in on secure channel." -RiffRaff
POIFECT! Another possibility = "Walking Contradiction"? -linuxmatt
Mine is the cellphone ring from "One Missed Call" or should I say "Chakushin ari". IMDB Info http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0366292/ -Necros
Ring tones? dang, I have to keep my phone on vibrate while at work (and when not at work, it's usually in my pocket, while I'm working around noisy machinery, so it's still on vibrate...) -garwain
Mine is the Imperial March... nuff said :) -elcapitane
Mine rings. Like http://www.hollywoodlostandfound.net/sounds/uniphone.wav . That's all. That may sound boring, but it actually gets more shocked reactions than anything else I've ever used. People start looking around, confused - like they did 7 years ago if you had a fancy new polyphonic ringtone. -veaudaux
( http://www.practicallyimpractical.com/TSC/st-phonering.mp3 ) But I like vea's -ShujinTribble
My ringtone for my boss is 'Number of the Beast' -torgo
For the general SF population: Iron Maiden's The Evil That Men Do.
For the special cases: Green Day's Jackass
For the boss: Rancid's David Courtney.
For my fellow techies: Iron Maiden's The Clansman.
-silocrydan
"24 Hours Open" on the Cowboy Bebop movie soundtrack. 10 seconds of bland tinny muzak, then massive submachine gun fire. I get some odd looks, but it makes me happy :) -TheCyberwolfe
HAH! You guys are great! Never occured to me until this very moment but how about a midi of "If I only had a brain!" -Leah2112
My ring tone for when the help desk calls me is a clip of a song from Eric Clapton. "Before you accuse me, take a look at yourself" -crazymactech
The teacher who taught me the most that I have ever learned in this field said essentially the same. When I post here about starfish they are most deserving.
Leah's definition of a starfish: Those who are unwilling to learn. Also see Fair Game -Leah2112
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